Dagger Forum

So I've been unemployed for the past two months and getting sober and I've had a lot of ideas rattling around that I've been meaning to express. I feel that this forum is probably the best place to do it as if I made a post like this on SA or another board I would probably be called a retard (among other pejorative terms). Basically I think this is the perfect place for pretentious posting about half-baked thoughts that I need to move past so I can focus on things that actually matter (in my case getting a job).

Anyways, so the job I just left was a tech support call center hell job where I was supporting mobile software. Basically I would have boomers from different companies calling in because some piece of company software on their corporate issued mobile device (usually an iPad) wasn't working properly. I was tasked with fixing their issues by remoting into their devices with a MDM (mobile device management program) and fixing it. So in this position I saw many a boomer struggle with the nightmare that is modern mobile UI. They told me what they were trying to do and I was able to see what they were actually doing on their screen in real time.

For the past 10 or more years tech companies have been scrambling to get devices that are more mobile and accessible to people that are not in traditionally technical fields. If you spend any time at all watching "tech" youtubers you start to think that this would only affect consumer facing pieces of software that are designed with your boomer parents in mind. Sadly this is not the case. The meme of big tile menu items, unintuitive gesture navigation, flat "material" design elements that are supposed to make the UI more colorful and appealing to people on SSRI medications, and basically any number of design changes that we have all seen over the past decade that have made mobile devices feel like fisher price toys have all spilled over to the business world as well. The idea behind this is that employers can cut down on the cost to train new employees by making once technical jobs that would require a formal education now be within the reach of anyone that managed to make it to the 9th grade. This of course means that you can hire contracted employees (no benefits) and pay them very little.

The irony of this software design is that it is actually more confusing for the average person that say Microsoft office 2003. Microsoft Office 2003 is designed in such a way that most of the menu options and settings are visiable on one screen. Someone using the software would require a point in the right direction but once they got the hang of it they should be able to find anything they're looking for just by scanning their eyes over the UI elements. Nu-Software on the other hand only displays a handful of menu options on one page and requires you to back-track constantly to find the item that you are looking for (often backtracking requires some kind of gesture command that you would already have to understand before opening the software). Basically nu-software contains a lot of wasted space and makes you feel like a retard.

I'll wrap this up because I kind of wanted to make this into a discussion about modern software/UI design. I just want to know what you guys think about it and the specific applications and trends that make you want to move to the Alaskan wilderness. Obviously there are a lot of other things we can discuss in this thread (like how modern software development is lazy and inefficient). Just like be yourself bro!

I feel like forcing employees to use things like ipads has nothing to do with productivity or efficiencies and more to do with data collection and monitoring. I have no idea of course, I don't work in the corporate sphere and nobody issues me nuthing but i would imagine that when employees were required to interact with Office 2003, optimizing human potential was the goal. Your employee was supposed to input the reasons they were hired into the collective. Ipad UI is meant to draw a person in to constant interaction and harnessing the ADHD quality of the modern consumer. You are meant to jump between apps as soon as your mind looses focus. multiple applications are hoovering in the background just waiting for the right moment to get your attention. it has very little to do with productivity with the exception of artist and designers who use it like a drawing/design tool. what it does do well is track how you use the devise, how long you are using particular apps, where you are going, where you have been, what stores you go to. If you carry it around with you all day it pretty much knows what you are like all day especially if the mic is on. I don't know how much employers do this or if they are just as retardedly boomeresque as their employees but it seems really weird that they would want to switch to using an Ipad in place of office 2003 on a pc. Touch pad typing sucks vs a real keyboard. Apps very rarely have the time tested stability of established business licensed software (again I don't know anything but i would imagine) I just feel like the corporate world is collecting data reasons to faze out human employees.

i feel like we almost give too much credit to companies who force modern tech into their daily operations. It just makes them feel like theyre adapting to the future. Then you go to the break room and no one's emptied the garbage for a week and the microwave always burns your food. total half-assed quasi-nu-business whatever you want to call it. Seriously, like, get computer monitors that weren't bought bulk and have the resolution of late-90s edutainment games. Ive worked for companies that have a matrix-style green and black DOSesq ui's, while putting up a front to customers that theyve got the principles of an Apple store or something

yoku wrote: ↑

Sun May 05, 2019 6:44 pm

I feel like forcing employees to use things like ipads has nothing to do with productivity or efficiencies and more to do with data collection and monitoring. I have no idea of course, I don't work in the corporate sphere and nobody issues me nuthing but i would imagine that when employees were required to interact with Office 2003, optimizing human potential was the goal. Your employee was supposed to input the reasons they were hired into the collective. Ipad UI is meant to draw a person in to constant interaction and harnessing the ADHD quality of the modern consumer. You are meant to jump between apps as soon as your mind looses focus. multiple applications are hoovering in the background just waiting for the right moment to get your attention. it has very little to do with productivity with the exception of artist and designers who use it like a drawing/design tool. what it does do well is track how you use the devise, how long you are using particular apps, where you are going, where you have been, what stores you go to. If you carry it around with you all day it pretty much knows what you are like all day especially if the mic is on. I don't know how much employers do this or if they are just as retardedly boomeresque as their employees but it seems really weird that they would want to switch to using an Ipad in place of office 2003 on a pc. Touch pad typing sucks vs a real keyboard. Apps very rarely have the time tested stability of established business licensed software (again I don't know anything but i would imagine) I just feel like the corporate world is collecting data reasons to faze out human employees.

well i know for skilled labor especially (i work in HVAC, but electricians, plumbers, etc.) having a slick new van and employee with iPad in hand will get you all the rich customers you desire. Rich people literally only want laborers that look nice so they don't have to think about the poverty and struggle they are going through. Fuck man, this one super executive building a bit North of us in Rich People Town (That Is Not Actually A Town, But A Registered Corporation) won't even let us use their elevators or bathrooms.

I think modern UI is intentionally designed to be confusing as another subtle evil slipped into modern life to put you in your place. People who think this shit works are so out of touch with the end user experience - and why should they be in touch? They farm these peoples' data to make buku bucks. As long as they're clicking and engaging, who gives a shit? Only upkeep you have to do is give it some "polish" and make it look more and more "minimalist" and "modern" every so often.

They don't give a shit about UI or end user experience because they don't have to, and really don't have any incentive to. As long as not using their platform cuts you off from certain pathways of large-scale social interaction, they will stay around. People always complain and complain but they still stay. Because that girl you like posts bikini pics on Instagram... that comedian you follow posts funny things on Twitter... long distance friends only keep up on Facebook, etc etc. It will either stay this bad or get worse. Only thing we can do now is rely on cool open source shit that isn't a total pile of bricks.

(disclaimer: only know very rudimentary IT and coding stuff, but UI design is more graphics and psychology so I feel as though I can speak on it)

ArcadeWeapon wrote: ↑

Sun May 05, 2019 7:28 pm

i feel like we almost give too much credit to companies who force modern tech into their daily operations. It just makes them feel like theyre adapting to the future. Then you go to the break room and no one's emptied the garbage for a week and the microwave always burns your food. total half-assed quasi-nu-business whatever you want to call it. Seriously, like, get computer monitors that weren't bought bulk and have the resolution of late-90s edutainment games. Ive worked for companies that have a matrix-style green and black DOSesq ui's, while putting up a front to customers that theyve got the principles of an Apple store or something

Yeah this is very true. I feel like most companies just ride on the coat-tails of other more successful/larger corporations. I get the impression that industry conferences are out of touch boomers are to blame for these trends being a pervasive as they are.

yoku wrote: ↑

Sun May 05, 2019 6:44 pm

well i know for skilled labor especially (i work in HVAC, but electricians, plumbers, etc.) having a slick new van and employee with iPad in hand will get you all the rich customers you desire. Rich people literally only want laborers that look nice so they don't have to think about the poverty and struggle they are going through. Fuck man, this one super executive building a bit North of us in Rich People Town (That Is Not Actually A Town, But A Registered Corporation) won't even let us use their elevators or bathrooms.

I think modern UI is intentionally designed to be confusing as another subtle evil slipped into modern life to put you in your place. People who think this shit works are so out of touch with the end user experience - and why should they be in touch? They farm these peoples' data to make buku bucks. As long as they're clicking and engaging, who gives a shit? Only upkeep you have to do is give it some "polish" and make it look more and more "minimalist" and "modern" every so often.

They don't give a shit about UI or end user experience because they don't have to, and really don't have any incentive to. As long as not using their platform cuts you off from certain pathways of large-scale social interaction, they will stay around. People always complain and complain but they still stay. Because that girl you like posts bikini pics on Instagram... that comedian you follow posts funny things on Twitter... long distance friends only keep up on Facebook, etc etc. It will either stay this bad or get worse. Only thing we can do now is rely on cool open source shit that isn't a total pile of bricks.

(disclaimer: only know very rudimentary IT and coding stuff, but UI design is more graphics and psychology so I feel as though I can speak on it)

I used to think that it was intentional because it certainly feels that way. Now I just think it's a chain reaction of incompetence but who is to say. I think that the practicality of design elements used to be a consideration and now it's taking a backseat to marketing and style b/c that's what hits the numbers? I really don't know whatever it is they don't make software for our demographic anymore because it isn't as successful as something with a more general mass-appeal.

There is a very specific pointed kind of anxiety that has been created in everyday people that really aren't equipped to deal with the modern reality of "interconnectedness" and social media that will prevent any of this "progress" from reversing. I think that Don is right. Whatever we thought about the world our ourselves even 5 years later is firmly in the rubbish bin. We are something else at this point and we're on the outskirts. There is something kind of romantic about being in this position. It's like being in some sort of cool cyberpunk bar talking about scrap electronics. It really doesn't depress me anymore and I've kind of come to accept it. It's gonna be one hell of a ride that's for sure.

ArcadeWeapon wrote: ↑

Sun May 05, 2019 7:28 pm

i feel like we almost give too much credit to companies who force modern tech into their daily operations. It just makes them feel like theyre adapting to the future. Then you go to the break room and no one's emptied the garbage for a week and the microwave always burns your food. total half-assed quasi-nu-business whatever you want to call it. Seriously, like, get computer monitors that weren't bought bulk and have the resolution of late-90s edutainment games. Ive worked for companies that have a matrix-style green and black DOSesq ui's, while putting up a front to customers that theyve got the principles of an Apple store or something

this makes more sense then my 1984 paranoid fantasy. its all just fluff and marketing